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DOGGETTJA
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 03:08 am |
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On a personal level I don't think I would have done anything much different. I am who I am, love this town, have lived here for many years. I tried to move us in a direction of more conservation, better world citizens, maintain some of our rural character. We can't stop developement but we can guide it and I think we have done a fair job of that.
In the election I made the mistake of thinking that the voters knew who I was and what I stood for. I did not want to take money from special intrest groups and I didn't so I set myself a limit and that was all I spent.
Voter turn out was the major issue I think along with communication. The CC's were bombarding the area with their material and then the majority of folks didn't vote. So it was sort of a double whammy. As a council we continually discussed ways to get the message out of what we were trying to do. And in the case of the Town Hall the cc's showed up at the eleventh hour. The land had been bought and the drawings done and all of a sudden there was this hew and cry about spending the money. Up until that time we had had no disenters at all. The Town Hall had been in the plans for at least 4 years.
The park luckily escaped but only because those of us who care have hammered away with Debbie as the leader and now Sue. We managed to keep the money in the budget for the 1st phase.
Obviously I made mistakes or I would still be on the council. I am terribly pragmatic and blunt which probably didn't help any either.
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Baseball Buddy
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 12:10 pm |
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Jane, those of us who know love you the way you are, don't change. As for the CC's getting DC and BS elected, They preyed on peoples emotions of not wanting to pay taxes and that is all. They could not tell you one single issue where they stood without having a confrence with one another and thinking it out before answering. If you are a Town Council Member you are in charge of running the Town. This involves spending tax dollars. To say no to spending means no to running a Town. These 2 will only agree with the other 3 if it personally benifits them in some way. Some more food for thought.
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 12:37 pm |
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Baseball Buddy wrote: Jane, those of us who know love you the way you are, don't change.
BB, I wasn't suggesting that Jane change nor was that my question.
The larger point I was asking was, would she in hindsight have changed any of her decisions public, personal or political. One can change their mind on an issue without compromising their person or principles.
I take great interest in the discussion, debate and implementation of public policy questions, political strategy and tactic, and public leadership issues. Clearly, Jane was/is in a wonderfully unique position to share with us what she and the others may have learned from this experience. While painful, sometimes the lessons learned in pain are more easily not forgotten than all of the successes and victories. And in the political arena most especially where that loss is felt at such a personal level.
In politics, it is said, that perceptions become reality (with voters).
My real question to Jane then, if you examine closely, was in hindsight, if there would have been ways to have changed the public perceptions, thus changing the dynamics of the underlying realities which were thus created by underlying misperceptions which started this whole political revolution and realignment.
Having said all of that, I do agree with BB. Don't change. It is the one essential vital ingredient in why so many love you both in Summerfield and around here on this Forum.
Last edited on Sep 5th, 2006 01:44 pm by Jim Flynt
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Cracker Jax
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 12:54 pm |
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DOGGETTJA wrote: Jim- As you know about 5 years ago the County quit sharing the sales tax with the small towns unless they charged a tax.
Wonderful discussion Ya'll. Thanks Waytago for pointing out that we perhaps need to "toot the horn" of the other council members once in a while. If we aren't careful, the names of the CC's are gonna be the most well known and that's who the uninformed voters will vote for. eek! 
I belive Jane's statement above is very important and one that most Summerfield citizens aren't aware of.
If Summerfield did not charge a tax then no money would be recieved from the county.
Kinda backwards but that's the county for ya!
The CC's are soley responsible for bringing the nasty side of politics to Summerfield. While their campaign tactics were based on half truths and sometimes outright lies, they played on people's pocketbooks and folks who didn't keep up or come to council meetings had no idea they were being bamboozled.
The sitting council at the time (Jane, Mike, Bob, Carolyn, Dena and Mark) was "blindsided". Since they were all just townfolk who love their town and wanted the best for Summerfield, they weren't prepared for the dirty politics and certainly weren't equipped to fight back. I still don't think any of them have it in them to base their campaigns on lies and deceit. I'm glad about that. I am very concerned about who's gonna be sitting in Bob, Carolyn and Dena's seats after the next election.
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 01:15 pm |
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Cracker Jax wrote: DOGGETTJA wrote: Jim- As you know about 5 years ago the County quit sharing the sales tax with the small towns unless they charged a tax.
If Summerfield did not charge a tax then no money would be recieved from the county.
Just to be both clear and fair, while it is true that Guilford County doesn't share the general sales tax with the small towns unless they impose a property tax, that does not mean that the small towns are without revenue sources. I understand that the loss of the sales tax revenue when Guilford County elected another method of distribution reduced a sizeable portion of their then yearly income.
Out of curiosity, what was the budget income for Summerfield prior to the sales tax being withheld versus afterwards (but prior to imposition of a local property tax)?
Obviously, the loss of the sales tax revenue would have meant a more limited small town government and services budget expenditures, but the observation seems clear that citizens (voters) were willing to accept a more limited form of government and the limited services a restrained budget could fund rather than face taxes (or higher taxes in the cumulative sense).
Finally, I am more clearly aware that faced with the same situation over here in Stokesdale in realizing loss of the county sales tax money, the Stokesdale Town Council decided to live more austerely within their limited budget rather than impose a property tax. And have done this while also providing the first municipal water system in the Northwest, limited police protection (lease of a GC Sheriff's deputy), and purchase of 25 acres for public purpose. And all of that having being done with absolutely no local property tax proposed or imposed. In so doing, the STC may well have 'spoiled' its' citizens with these services without taxes, but that is a two edged sword which swings both ways and will ultimately come back to cut their heads off when and if they ever do propose such. Voters always vote for or against incumbents based on what have you done for (or to) me lately.
And it is my honest belief, that the Stokesdale Town Council members would be summararily dismissed ("bounced out on their ears") by the Stokesdale citizens/voters the very instant they that came out in favor of a town property tax. IF and WHEN a town property is ever PROPOSED or imposed in Stokesdale, there will/would be a political revolution and realignment of the town council members which would make the one in Summerfield pale by comparison. No one over here has to tell the Stokesdale town council members THAT, they clearly understand it. Their political fear serves as some form of protection for what are and would be a large group of concerned citizens of Stokesdale.
So in looking and comparing two very similar yet different Northwest communities and how they each reacted in a different manner to the exact same stimuli, that is why I cannot for the life of me see why the sitting town council in Summerfield at the time could not have seen or envisioned the political revolution and realignment coming. To me, it would have seemed inevitable.
One other trusim in politics, is that people always vote with their wallets.
Last edited on Sep 5th, 2006 01:36 pm by Jim Flynt
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Lacka
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 04:16 pm |
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FatPappy wrote:
(Mr Mike, I think a broom suits her better than a shovel...)
Ran across this while looking for a spider for Jane. Couldn't help myself.
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DOGGETTJA
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 05:10 pm |
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Jim I can give you rough figures for the before and after the county took the tax. Before our income was somewhere around 900 to 1 million dollars as I remember after around $50,000. Now that is as I remember it and I have pitched all my budget material.
I was not surprised that people did not jump up and down and congratulate the town on charging a tax but I was surprised at the personal attacks I and the other council members were subject to. My stock answer and I tried to keep it mind when this was all going on is that for $5.00 and some campaign signs you too can be a council member.
I am shocked at the ugliness that the cc's spew out but the total lack of involvement in a solution. Stokesdale is a little different as you are smaller but Summerfield is growing rapidly and is considered a mid sized town in NC and with that comes requirements mandated but not paid for by the mandators such as some major clean water issues that will be expensive when we have to implement them probably in the next few years. Don't we need a plan and a way to pay for it? There are several things that because of our size and our desire to direct our destiny that will cost us in Summerfield. We have a planning department because we were not getting the individualized service from the county that people felt we needed. That costs us money. What do we do if the water dries up? Unless the town is prepared to buy up the open land to protect the water we can not stop people who want to develop from developing. The Town has been working on a water option for years and years.
I guess in hind sight Jim if I had wanted to possibly remain on the Town Council I would have had to given up what I viewed as an absolute necessity which was a steady income that would allow us to make this town a good community not just a place to live.
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Hairbrush
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 05:53 pm |
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I like the fact that Summerfield is trying to act like a town. I hate the ugliness that I saw when the concerned citizens started coming into power. What ever happened to the golden rule "do unto others". The concerned citizens ran on a no tax agenda yet they were more than willing to attend a training for new council members that was out of town and let the tax payers pay mileage, overnight stays and meals. Did they really learn anything more important going a few weeks early? Not sure if I have seen any signs of it.
Not that I don't think the council members should be paid for some of their time and expenses, but I didn't see the 2 concerned citizens council members jump and down and yell that they couldn't take the money. Seems one was more concerned on how to file taxes in whether they should take the money or not.
I see a lot of nay-saying from the concerned citizens and their council members but not a lot of solutions, unless you consider DC paying for Christmas cards and giving a donation to ballfields (and I definitely don't agree that he was giving up his retirement money, but maybe he was donating his stipend).
And you know at least if I pay some taxes in the town of Summerfield I can have some of the sales tax back from Guilford County. Why should they keep all my hard earned money. I would like to spend it in my Town building parks, recreation fields and who knows maybe one day we will finally get that new town hall we so desperately need.
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DOGGETTJA
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 05:58 pm |
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| Yeah Hairbrush!!!
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FatPappy
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 06:46 pm |
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Cracker Jax wrote:
The CC's are soley responsible for bringing the nasty side of politics to Summerfield. While their campaign tactics were based on half truths and sometimes outright lies, they played on people's pocketbooks and folks who didn't keep up or come to council meetings had no idea they were being bamboozled.
The sitting council at the time (Jane, Mike, Bob, Carolyn, Dena and Mark) was "blindsided". Since they were all just townfolk who love their town and wanted the best for Summerfield, they weren't prepared for the dirty politics and certainly weren't equipped to fight back.
You're exactly right, Crackah! I know some of us harp a lot on the negatives of the CC bunch till some folks may get tired of hearin' it. But I don't want anybody to ferget what they did, how they did it, an' who they're really concerned about -- THEMSELVES AND THEIR POCKETBOOKS ONLY! Let's be absolutely clear on that last point!
I'm proud o' Jane, Mike, Bob, Carolyn, Dena and Mark an' all the other selfless citizen volunteers who are doin' what they can fer their town! And, yes they don't get as much forum time as the others, but they get our admiration fer doin' what they do. In their honor, here's a big ol'
YEE HAW!
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Bubba
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 07:58 pm |
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everyone I talked to during the election-were like they won't get in- they are crazy. But the day after I asked them did you vote! They were like no, but I didn't think they would get elected it just a little town election.
Thank you to MARK BROWN, DENA BARNES, CAROLYN COLLINS, BOB WILLIAMS for continuing to nurture and help the citizens of Summerfield in our effort to become a healthy will-rounded town
and also Jane Doggett and Mike Stewart. Hey guys are you going to run next time?
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Bubba
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Posted: Sep 5th, 2006 08:01 pm |
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| Development is going to happen like Jane said earlier, But without our TC those developments could have been double the houses. They have helped slow the growing pains just a little.
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FatPappy
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Posted: Sep 6th, 2006 01:31 am |
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Jim Flynt wrote:
...I cannot for the life of me see why the sitting town council in Summerfield at the time could not have seen or envisioned the political revolution and realignment coming. To me, it would have seemed inevitable.
You make an interestin' point, Mr Jim. It's a lot like sayin' if the young lady hadn't worn that seductive outfit an' walked alone at night she wouldn't have gotten attacked. Maybe it's true the actions of the victim could have been smarter, but that in no way justifies the attack. The previous council were not politicians, they were citizens focusing on trying to do some good for their town.
I don't for a minute, not even a micro-nano second, believe the CC's care about this town. Their only interests, their ONLY INTERESTS are their own narrow self interests centered around their own pocket books.
One thing we can thank the CC's for is waking us up. That and some good entertainment.
(Pappy's bein' lazy tonight an' takin' a break from the action. Can't wait to read the reports from the meeting.)
I hate politics. I really do.
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Lacka
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Posted: Sep 6th, 2006 02:00 am |
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Yeah Jane and Mike, so are you? I am thinking that more people will get out there and vote this time. Either that or they really do not care about where they live.
BTW Mom left tonight on her broom about 6:45. I was sweatin' it, there were some empty seats over by me and I just knew she was headed my way. She didn't tho. Not sure who that was she sat with, have never seen him before.
Does anyone know why in the world BS and DC would vote against raising the credit card limit. It seemed like the thing to do to me. I am sure that the users are not abusing the cards. I would assume that they have to be accountable for anything they spend, so......not like they are using the card to buy a new truck or to build a ball field.
WOW the Parks and Rec I was amazed at the list of citizens and neighbors who donated time, equipment, and products. This is a great example of what our town is about.
A few mentioned were Donna and Glen from the Garden outlet donated landscaping materials
Murphys removed dead limbs so that all park areas would be safe for walking and playing.
The fire department donated their boat and equipment to help with lake clean up.
Vince Williams of Creative Garden Spaces helped with moving something big with one of those man machines.......
Republic donated a container for debris...
I am sure that I have left people out so if you were there and I did, please list them....
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Lacka
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Posted: Sep 6th, 2006 02:16 am |
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FatPappy wrote:
One thing we can thank the CC's for is waking us up. That and some good entertainment.
Pap, I once thought this was true, OK it was fun at first, it was quite the side show, but now they are just waisting our time.
It is embarrassing that the news crews come to our town to report on what the circus was doing.
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