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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Apr 27th, 2007 01:26 am |
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Baseball Buddy wrote: We have people working with the Town who are "REAL" experts in acquiring land for development of ballfields. This group has been doing this since 1970. They have a great track record and have aquired land and developed many many ballfields.
OK.
I'm dumb so I'm game.
I was not aware that the Summerfield had engaged outside ballfield experts and perhaps others aren't either, so it would seem beneficial if you could elaborate and tell everyone more.
WHO are these "REAL" experts you mention?
Which tracts of land have they acquired and which ballfields have "they" developed?
What is the cost to the citizens and Town of Summerfield for these "REAL" experts?
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GRITS
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Posted: Apr 27th, 2007 01:34 am |
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Jim, I think it is time to stop attacking BB. He is trying to help the Summerfield community. I wish you could understand that. You cut down trees in Stokesdale, so stop cutting down BB. He is a gentleman, and I thank him for at least trying to give back to our community. If your are trying to help that is great. Share your knowledge so we can get moving on this. I am not flaming by no means, this discussion needs to be open minded, so please keep that in mind.
By the way , I thought you did not have "dog in this fight."
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Apr 27th, 2007 02:10 am |
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GRITS wrote: Jim, I think it is time to stop attacking BB. He is trying to help the Summerfield community. I wish you could understand that. You cut down trees in Stokesdale, so stop cutting down BB. He is a gentleman, and I thank him for at least trying to give back to our community. If your are trying to help that is great. Share your knowledge so we can get moving on this. I am not flaming by no means, this discussion needs to be open minded, so please keep that in mind.
By the way , I thought you did not have "dog in this fight."
Grits, say what you will, your entire post was a FLAMING attack on me even as you accused me of attacking the previous poster by simply asking that poster to expound on his own comments. You duplicitously engaged in the very same behavior which you accused me of so falsely.
Reasonable and prudent people would not read a personal attack in my simply asking that a poster expound on his own comments, for the education of a public with a right to know.
You even go so far as to say (hypocritically, I might add) that "this discussion needs to be open minded" until, of course, myself or anyone espouses any position contrary to your own or questions the veracity of a statement made (which of course defeats the very concept of 'open mindedness' that you pay hollow lip service to without any genuine sincerity).
I take it that you did not or do not think that the questions which I asked were reasonable?
I honestly was not and am not aware of the specifics which BB himself raised and while I would certainly like to know more. I am also sure other uneducated or undereducated readers might also benefit from BB expanding on his own comments. If "REAL" experts are being engaged by the Town of Summerfield, don't the citizens of the community have a right to know?
Personally, I wish the Town of Summerfield would spend every last cent of the nearly Ten Million Dollars of tax payer money they have in the bank and build as many ballfields and ballparks as Ten Million Dollars will buy, so that all the whiners could then move forward to other topics and issues.
With all due respects, I share the blessing and joy that all citizens from Oak Ridge and Stokesdale live free of in not being distracted in our own growing communities with this, your never ending war and community division over ballfields that Summerfield has been cursed with. Why this issue continues to divide and besiege your community and it's citizens is beyond my intelligence, imagination or understanding.
After ten years of Summerfield talking about building ballfields, the debate is getting a little tired for those of us in the rest of the Northwest if not Summerfield don't you think?
Perhaps we are both saying the same thing: As the old saying goes, maybe it's simply time for Summerfield to quit or git off the pot.
If ever an academic or political or athletic or development institution wanted to discover or derive the perfect case study in 'How Not To Develop A Community Ballpark', they should look no further than the Town of Summerfield, North Carolina.
Last edited on Apr 27th, 2007 02:48 am by Jim Flynt
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Super Moderator
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Posted: Apr 27th, 2007 11:54 am |
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GRITS wrote: I wish you could understand that so stop cutting down BB. By the way , I thought you did not have "dog in this fight."
Jim Flynt wrote:
Grits, say what you will, your entire post was a FLAMING attack on me even as you accused me of attacking the previous poster by simply asking that poster to expound on his own comments. You duplicitously engaged in the very same behavior which you accused me of so falsely. Reasonable and prudent people would not read a personal attack You even go so far as to say (hypocritically, I might add) that "this discussion needs to be open minded" until, of course, myself or anyone espouses any position contrary to your own or questions the veracity of a statement made (which of course defeats the very concept of 'open mindedness' that you pay hollow lip service to without any genuine sincerity). After ten years of Summerfield talking about building ballfields, the debate is getting a little tired for those of us in the rest of the Northwest if not Summerfield don't you think?
This "verbal fist fight" needs to end, and get back on the topic of Ballfields please.
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Apr 27th, 2007 12:46 pm |
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Super Moderator wrote: This "verbal fist fight" needs to end, and get back on the topic of Ballfields please.
M. Supermoderator: I think if you will go back and review my earlier post (2 posts back), a careful reading will show that I simply asked the previous poster ('Baseball Buddy') to elaborate and expound on this comments regarding "REAL" experts which Summerfield seems to have engaged.
I then simply responded to what any reasonable person would clearly see as a FLAME attack by the poster posting as "Grits."
My most previous comments were simply pointing out that violation of the NWO Forum policy on flaming a poster as well as highlighting the duplicity of this poster in making their attack.
I have no interest in any verbal 'fist fight' with anyone nor do I feel that either of my most previous posts are reflective of such.
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Apr 27th, 2007 12:50 pm |
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Jim Flynt wrote: Baseball Buddy wrote: We have people working with the Town who are "REAL" experts in acquiring land for development of ballfields. This group has been doing this since 1970. They have a great track record and have aquired land and developed many many ballfields.
I was not aware that the Summerfield had engaged outside ballfield experts and perhaps others aren't either, so it would seem beneficial if you could elaborate and tell everyone more.
WHO are these "REAL" experts you mention?
Which tracts of land have they acquired and which ballfields have "they" developed?
What is the cost to the citizens and Town of Summerfield for these "REAL" experts?
Despite the FLAME ATTACK on me personally regarding my earlier post, I hope that the questions which I previously posed to Baseball Buddy will not go unanswered, as an expansion and clarification of BB's earlier comments would seem to be in order, and might assist the larger public in their own education of these issues.
That, of course, assumes that open mindedness and transparency in governmental decision making is at all important to anyone in this discussion.
Last edited on Apr 27th, 2007 12:56 pm by Jim Flynt
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GRITS
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Posted: Apr 27th, 2007 03:25 pm |
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Jim Flynt wrote: Baseball Buddy wrote: We have people working with the Town who are "REAL" experts in acquiring land for development of ballfields. This group has been doing this since 1970. They have a great track record and have aquired land and developed many many ballfields.
OK.
I'm dumb so I'm game.
I was not aware that the Summerfield had engaged outside ballfield experts and perhaps others aren't either, so it would seem beneficial if you could elaborate and tell everyone more.
WHO are these "REAL" experts you mention?
What is the cost to the citizens and Town of Summerfield for these "REAL" experts?
Town Continues to Seek Recreation Property
SUMMERFIELD – At the meeting on Nov. 14, the Summerfield Town Council voted to move forward on hiring an environmental specialist and land design firm to investigate two properties the town is considering purchasing. In June, the town allocated $1.15 million of its $1.9 million annual budget toward buying land and building athletic fields for citizens.
At the November council meeting, Town Administrator Michael Brandt proposed an environmental firm review the properties and a consultant provide basic athletic field layout. .
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FatPappy
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Posted: Apr 27th, 2007 05:11 pm |
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Much obliged fer that reminder, Grits. Hopefully we're gettin' toward the end o' the process an' some actual construction can begin so these young'uns can get out there while they're still young'uns. Those years go by so fast!
An' a big ol YEE HAW an' much obliged to BB fer givin' so much o' your time to our young'uns! Lots o' people in Summerfield who know what you do share that sentiment.
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Gestalt
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Posted: Apr 28th, 2007 12:15 am |
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FatPappy wrote: An' a big ol YEE HAW an' much obliged to BB fer givin' so much o' your time to our young'uns! Lots o' people in Summerfield who know what you do share that sentiment.
Agreed......BB you have many supporters who see your dedication and appreciate what you do. From my observations (unscientific and with no data to support other than my own judgements) I think it's about 95%/5% pro/con. So keep up what you're doin'.
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GRITS
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Posted: Apr 29th, 2007 11:30 pm |
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| Now that the viewing of the properties are over, when will the council move forward and make a decision? Does anyone have a clue?
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StewartM
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Posted: Apr 30th, 2007 11:12 am |
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| Grits they should have a public meeting in May....Its time to decide and get the ball rolling....
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Apr 30th, 2007 12:03 pm |
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StewartM wrote: Grits they should have a public meeting in May....Its time to decide and get the ball rolling....
Amen Mr. Mike. I second that emotion.
Good Luck tonight too Mr. Mike! Hope you bring home the bacon!
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Shamu
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Posted: May 1st, 2007 09:08 pm |
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I still request that if you post on this site, and you receive money for any type of goods or service from the Town of Summerfield, you say so.
If you own commercial or investment property within 1/2 mile of any of the sites, you say so.
You have a relative or significant friendship or relationship with someone who does fall in the above two categories, you say so - you get to say on this one, let your conscience be your guide.
Now, I understand why some outsiders are puzzled about what's the dilly-O with ballfields and Summerfield.
If the ballfields are going to be put near me, I want to have a substantial amount of input in the front end and the back end. I thought that was why Summerfield incorporated; to allow individual citizens and small groups to have a say. And if that’s what I want for me, I think its reasonable to assume that other people would like that too Remember the golden rule.
I am not against ballfields. I think we should find a suitable area, have lots of discussions with nearby residents, and see if we can find a win-win situation, perhaps negotiating on the number of fields, number of lights and types of lights, parking capacity, hours of operation etc.
Right now, I think the best site is the Marshall property. It is large enough to get several good fields, has very few nearby neighbors (and we still need to talk with them in great detail to find out their concerns), has expansion capacity, and there is a clear path to purchase with a ready and willing seller.
The Summerfield Road area is highly unwanted by nearby residents ( I say this because I am in possession of a petition with over 35 names on it – and many more residents to be contacted), has a highway planned through the middle of it, and a seller who doesn’t have control of the transaction, because someone who we can only assume is against the use of the land as ballfields has a right of first refusal ( so even if it can be bought, which is unlikely, it will cost much more than the “estimated costs” given out at the “Open Houses”.). I also think there are environmental issues with the site relating to the Greensboro watershed and groundwater contamination (I am waiting on MB to respond to me regarding these issues).
But none the less, the “Friddle-Holland-whoever else needs to be involved site” lives on. Wonder why? See the beginning of this post.
P.S. I am not going to publicly post the Rabbit Hollow Road of 2004 story, as its not about what’s going on now, and some of the players have changed, but will be glad to private post if you request. But I do have one question to Town Council and Admin; how come $150,000 was enough for ballfields in 2004 and now its 1.15 $Million.
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GRITS
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Posted: May 2nd, 2007 02:12 am |
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Shamu wrote: shamu: I still request that if you post on this site, and you receive money for any type of goods or service from the Town of Summerfield, you say so.
grits: ANSWER IS STILL = ZERO
Shamu: If you own commercial or investment property within 1/2 mile of any of the sites, you say so.
Grits: ANSWER IS = ZERO
Shamu: You have a relative or significant friendship or relationship with someone who does fall in the above two categories, you say so - you get to say on this one, let your conscience be your guide.
Grits: ANSWER IS = ALL RESIDENTS ON SUMMERFIELD ROAD
Shamu; If the ballfields are going to be put near me, I want to have a substantial amount of input in the front end and the back end. I thought that was why Summerfield incorporated; to allow individual citizens and small groups to have a say. And if that’s what I want for me, I think its reasonable to assume that other people would like that too Remember the golden rule.
Grits: DO UNTO OTHERS AS YOU WOULD HAVE DONE TO YOU UUMMM = SOMETHING TO THINK ABOUT. I'll let your conscience be your guide.
Shamu: I am not against ballfields. I think we should find a suitable area, have lots of discussions with nearby residents, and see if we can find a win-win situation, perhaps negotiating on the number of fields, number of lights and types of lights, parking capacity, hours of operation etc. GRITS:"I am sure this is more than likely to be discussed, it is an important issue. number of fields preferrably 8--more choices for the other children to participate in other activites other than baseball. lights= no input, I have no expertise here to even begin. I will leave that up to the planning board. Parking = adequate parking to accomodate large numbers, there does not be an overfill. Again, not an expert--I will leave that as well to the experts. Hours of operation = clearly should begin at a reasonable time that allows as much daytime hours as possible, but will also take into consideration the time that correlates after school hours and any programs that kids participate in. The night hours should have an ordinance of some sort. I do not particularly appreciate kids playing until 10pm, but hopefully with the addition of numerous fields, more than one can can be played. But, if a time limit should be placed I would go no longer than 10pm.
Shamu; Right now, I think the best site is the Marshall property. It is large enough to get several good fields, has very few nearby neighbors (and we still need to talk with them in great detail to find out their concerns), has expansion capacity, and there is a clear path to purchase with a ready and willing seller. Grits: STRONGLY DISAGREE: HEAVY TRAFFIC ON 220---SOFT WETLAND TOWARD THE BACK OF PROPERTY---A WIDE GULLY WITH A STREAM. AN ATTRACTIVE NUISANCE THAT COULD BE POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS TO CHILDREN. OUR KIDS ARE AFFECTED AT THE FRONT OF THE PROPERTY AND THE BACK. Cost substantially more than the other two properties.
Shamu; The Summerfield Road area is highly unwanted by nearby residents ( I say this because I am in possession of a petition with over 35 names on it – and many more residents to be contacted),
Grits; So you have maybe 36 maybe 40. I don't really know, but do know that more are in favor than you allude to. And I am not sure how substantial this information is when referring back to your post regarding resident counts within a .25 to 0.5 mile radius. Seems rather low in comparision to you 99 + count. I would also think that due to the ballfields current location at Summerfield school, you and your neighbors would be more affected by the current traffic congestion, lights, and noise. This is much more in closer proximity to Rabbit Hollow Road than the "Summerfield Road" property. I fail to see your argument here. Shamu: has a highway planned through the middle of it, Grits: This does not have to happen--according to past articles and the town council--this property does not have to be given up. The state can not take this property unless the town willing does so. This road has been talked about over 40 years, and can remember my grandparents talking about this. Again, this is no where in the futuristic plans of the DOT--- there is no money. This is a FACT. Studies have been done on Auburn road and the intersection of 220, the road can not handle any more traffic load according to EMS director Bob Wray in it's current form simply due to safety purposes. What would you rather have, nuisance from road congestion at all times of the day and night or nuisance from a community ballpark which eventually does end at some point of the day/evening. Shamu: and a seller who doesn’t have control of the transaction, because someone who we can only assume is against the use of the land as ballfields has a right of first refusal ( so even if it can be bought, which is unlikely, it will cost much more than the “estimated costs” given out at the “Open Houses”.). I Grits; Did you not say something to the effect of these number should not be given great thought or start holding to the exact dollar, or even close? If so, then the Marshall property is by far the most unattainable price. Don't start inflating the price when the exact numbers are not there.
Shamu; also think there are environmental issues with the site relating to the Greensboro watershed and groundwater contamination (I am waiting on MB to respond to me regarding these issues). Grits; No more than Food Lion or any other businesses located in this area. The only contamination I see at the present moment is the vacant delipidated, rat infested Old Food Lion that Agapion owns, and no one can do anything about. When the ballfields are all said and done (regardless of location) I would love to have you tackle this one and get it cleaned up or removed. Off the subject a little--but if ballfields went on Summerfield road, this vacant building could be used for an atheletic center for everyone. You should also address the creek on the Marshall property if you are really concerned about contamination into the watershed. Where does this creek drain to? A new housing development is going in behind this property--which also contributes to contamination, if your argument is that ballfields cause contamination. Any type of constructions can contribute to this.
But none the less, the “Friddle-Holland-whoever else needs to be involved site” lives on. Wonder why? See the beginning of this post.
Shamu: P.S. I am not going to publicly post the Rabbit Hollow Road of 2004 story, as its not about what’s going on now,
Grits; Yes it most definitely is, I will let your conscience be your guide. Grits; The cost of ballfields; uumm in my opinion at this time in this long drawn out saga; " PRICELESS" Last edited on May 2nd, 2007 03:12 pm by GRITS
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Super Moderator
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Posted: May 2nd, 2007 10:09 am |
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Shamu wrote: I still request that if you post on this site, and you receive money for any type of goods or service from the Town of Summerfield, you say so.
If you own commercial or investment property within 1/2 mile of any of the sites, you say so.
You have a relative or significant friendship or relationship with someone who does fall in the above two categories, you say so - you get to say on this one, let your conscience be your guide.
You may "request" participants post this information, however it's of everyone's free will to do, or not to do. This is a discussion forum, not a "discovery" process.
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