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commonsensesum
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Posted: Nov 2nd, 2006 01:30 am |
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Kris:
Okay, forget Grimsley at 10-0 and probably the best 4A team in the state. How about: Smith is 1-9 (just like us and they are the only team we have beaten this year) and their band played almost continuously in the rain at their place. Last year during a rainy game at NW, our band did not even show up. Cheerleaders and dance teams were there and performed in the rain. Last year, I read in the NWO "Questions you have Asked" that the response from the school (band director?) was that the rain would damage the instruments. I wonder how Smith's instruments are immune to the rain.
I wish our band director and other decision makers would attend at least one away game and compare the other school's band performance at a game to ours. That is the only way folks will see the difference.
Friday, win or lose, will be Northwest's last game this year and the last game the band will perform so this issue is dead for another year. Good luck in the future, I'm outta there!
Last edited on Nov 2nd, 2006 01:32 am by commonsensesum
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bama80
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Posted: Nov 2nd, 2006 01:32 pm |
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Well, by your earlier logic: Smith's excellent band and spirit = a 1-9 record.
Sorry commonsenseum, I just don't get it.
Oh and for the instruments, every time they get wet, they have to be dried out. The inside of some are made to be moist due to moisture from the performers mouth. However, just like a set of tools, etc the instruments will rust. Some of them such as woodwinds suffer more from moisture than others. Others are more complicated and would require more labor to be repaired/cleaned if they were to rust. The NW band also performs on saturdays, (the day after friday) at competitions where the highest quality is expected from the instruments, uniforms, and overall appearance. A rainy friday night would definitely have an effect on this. I am sure the football team would not want the band to sacrifice its competition on saturday for the football teams competition on Friday.
Oh and Im sure the band would do better at the competitions on saturday if some of the football players came out and cheered them on. hah.
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commonsensesum
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Posted: Nov 3rd, 2006 04:25 am |
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bama80
I'm not sure what you don't get. I mentioned how great Grimsley's band and school spirit were and Kris suggested that was because they were 10-0 and a great team so team spirit would naturally be high. I then used the Smith example to show that a team with a horrible record (1-9) has great school spirit and their band played practically the entire game, i.e. team spirit and band playing have little to do with the record of the football team.
Just for the record, I do not have a son or other relative that does or has ever played football at NWHS.
From all the responses on this subject, it is clear to me that the NWHS Band's main purpose in life is band competitions.
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Nov 3rd, 2006 08:52 am |
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commonsensesum wrote: From all the responses on this subject, it is clear to me that the NWHS Band's main purpose in life is band competitions.
Commonsensesum: Please share with us what you think the 'main purpose' or role of the NWHS Band should be.
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CiCi
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Posted: Nov 3rd, 2006 01:50 pm |
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Has anyone heard the comments of the NW STUDENTS in regards to their
school band?
I've heard them say "our school band is awful," "our school band can only
play one song" (an exaggeration I'm sure but if that's their perception....),
"other school bands are so much better than ours even if they have losing teams."
As the parent of a student who attends every home and
away football game (with fellow students), these are the comments I've heard.
School SPIRIT is not entirely dependent on having a team that does not lose -
witness the School Spirit of Eastern Guilford High students who have
lost EVERYTHING.
Our band seems not to WANT to support our sports teams........football is
not the ONLY sport at our school !.......................NW students attend away football
because the opposing team generates the excitement with THEIR BAND and
their own school spirit! Our students DO NOTICE other schools' bands!!!!!!!!!
Is there music, cheerleaders, FANS! at our other sporting events?????????
Maybe if those other teams were supported by cheerleaders, a pep band,
etc., those same fans in attendance & those players would support the
other school teams.....we have too many teams where the players say
"No one (students, administrators) cares about us -
they only care about - provide expensive unforms for - & show up to support -
football."
As any college/pro player will tell you, it DOES help a team to see and hear
support from the stands! A good band CAN get fans (students AND parents)
to games !!!!!!!!! And 'parents' are where your donations for new facilities
come from!
We have the smartest kids in Guilford County, they work
and train hard.......so why are they losing so much in football ??????????
Maybe some 'accountability' would help?
If the
school itself cared about having winning teams, they would see team support,
game attendance, school spirit and DONATIONS, etc. all increase.
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Nov 3rd, 2006 01:58 pm |
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CiCi, again I would repeat my earlier question:
Please share with us what you think the 'main purpose' or role of the NWHS Band should be.
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bama80
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Posted: Nov 3rd, 2006 03:56 pm |
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Isnt the footballs team's main concentration on their games on friday night? Of course the band is there for spirit, etc but there is only so much one group of kids can do. remember that is really what you are relying on. They have homework and other commitments also. As Kris MCneill said in a previous post, a Pep band would have to be student led. There are also kdis inthe marching band that are in other sports at other times of the year. During football season, (band competition season) the band practices 3-4 days out of the week I believe. Kris please confirm/correct this if I am wrong.
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Kris McNeill
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Posted: Nov 3rd, 2006 04:52 pm |
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commonsensesum wrote: i.e. team spirit and band playing have little to do with the record of the football team.
I am becoming more and more confused as this thread grows.
commonsensesum, your above statement conflicts with your original posting which was concern over the level of school spirit at NWHS/the football team's record and pretty much directly blamed the band for that.
commonsensesum wrote: Although there has been some school spirit displayed at games this year, it is lacking when compared to other schools, especially with a student population of 2400+. Perhaps it is because our football team is now 4-17 over the last two seasons and our basketball team is just average.
I think this is probably a more accurate reason for any lack of school spirit. I have no idea why the football team has struggled this year and last. It might be the coach or it might be the players or both. I am not a basketball fan so I can't speak to that team.
But there is one thing that I know I can say for sure. Win or lose, those young men on the football team (or basketball team) deserve respect and should be told, "if you did your best on the field of competition, that is all that matters." This is what my children have learned from Mr. Brian McMath, director of the NWHS band program.
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CiCi
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Posted: Nov 3rd, 2006 05:31 pm |
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To Answer Jim Flynt's question:
I may be way off on my thinking but.....I had always thought an actual Marching band
has a goal of being ambassadors for the school.
In lieu of having a pep band,
I had assumed the Marching Band's job would be to put on entertaining field shows
at football games, as well as attending some competitions and also engaging the
audience with their music at sporting events, parades, etc.
As to school spirit and team records:
The school Spirit of students & the band SHOULD be shown
whether a team is winning or losing - as long as they're doing their best, the
support should be there and it should be heard.
I don't blame the band for a team's
record, but - any and all support - whether from fans or bands - can only help a
teams' motivation and confidence while they are playing.
Unfortunately, whether for high school, college or pro teams,
support of a team (as shown by attendance and/or donations) is often based on a
teams' record.....
it shouldn't be that way, but it is.
Everyone (students, faculty, parents and the band) could decide to each try a
little harder to make use of their talents to increase support and spirit.
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Kris McNeill
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Posted: Nov 3rd, 2006 06:03 pm |
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I will address the issue of the NWHS Marching Band being a "competition band":
Not all high school bands participate in the band competition arena. The NWHS Band has a long standing tradition as a "competing marching band" - this began in 1975 when Mr. Tommy Smith became the band director. He left a legacy behind when he retired in 2000 after 25 years at Northwest. Mr. Brian Roberts directed the band program 2000-2004 - he was a student of Mr. Smith's.
Mr. Brian McMath came to NWHS in 2004. He is an amazing band director, a gifted musician and performer, but most of all a first class teacher, mentor, "coach", and example to the 200+ students in the band program. He is doing an excellent job of continuing Mr. Smith's vision and legacy for the NW Band.
Tradition is very important. It's often the "glue" that holds a school or community together. Perhaps other schools have different traditions in regard to their band/school spirit/football? The Smith HS Band performs in a completely different style than the NW Band. That's Smith's tradition and legacy. Grimsley HS really showcases their drumline at football and basketball games - it's a longstanding tradition. The Northwest Band has different traditions and part of that is being a competition band.
The band is at every home game and sometimes travel to an away game. The students play their hearts out in the stands and on the field at halftime/pregame because they love music and what they do. In between, they root for the football team. Then, they often get up early on Saturday morning and travel to a competition, sometimes returning long after midnight.
The band learns one show each year(this year it is titled "Hieroglyphics" and if you pay attention, there is much to learn from the show!) because of the high level of musical and drill difficulty that these students are performing. It takes them weeks and weeks to memorize music and steps.
The kind of blame that is being thrown around here is not going to help the football team or any NWHS athletic team, the band, the cheerleaders, the dance team or the student body at large. The only way to affect change or make improvements in a situation is to communicate well with the various people who are in charge. In this case, it would be the band director, the athletic director, the principal, the coach(es),etc.
I very much enjoy the NWO forums and having the opportunity to exchange ideas here! I think it is a great avenue of communication for the northwest area. I hope those who have concerns will take their ideas to the appropriate leaders because those are the folks who can make changes or improvements. I would love to see lots of school spirit at NWHS! I'm an alumni, my children are 2005 and 2007 NWHS grads and I hope to have grandchildren there (and in the band!) one day!
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S. Smith
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Posted: Nov 4th, 2006 08:11 pm |
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I have to agree with Kris on this one. As a former band booster parent, the NWHS band legacy is strong. What's more, when you consider the number of kids involved and the dedication it takes for them to be a highly-rated, competition-class band, it is pretty impressive. Our band went to a bowl game in Florida (winning a competition there and getting to perform their show at the game), and this year I think they're planning to go to the Fiesta Bowl. I have the utmost respect for Mr. McMath.
However, I would also love to hear more "stands" music at football games (I thought I had heard that recorded music they play was chosen by the announcer and/or football boosters, but this could be incorrect). I would also love to see a pep band. Maybe some enterprising student will take this on as a project.
Regarding the sports teams, I don't know what the problem is. I do know that some teams do incredibly well year after year.
Here's a theory I heard recently. Someone told me they thought teams like football and boys basketball don't do that well at NWHS because the number of participants is diluted. In other words, in areas where there's not much else to do but play football or basketball, maybe they're more likely to excel. But at NW, there are so many sports teams to choose from. A kid who might be the best football player the school has ever seen might be playing soccer instead. This person also said because NW is such an affluent area, the "country club" sports are the ones that really excel, like golf and tennis, or the more "upscale" team sports like lacrosse.
What do you guys think about that?
Last edited on Nov 4th, 2006 08:14 pm by S. Smith
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ff12
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Posted: Nov 4th, 2006 08:32 pm |
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There can be many reasons. Since I do not know the coaching staff I just want every one to know that i am not attacking them. This is where it all starts , at school that is< if the coaches dont demand the best from the kids in practice, or in the classroom, and also in there daily lives then he will not get the best on Fri. night. There also is a fine line between parents encouraging the kids to give it their best all the time and pushing so hard that the kids dont care anymore. The biggest thing to remember is that we are talking about TEENAGERS , I know back when I was that age my mind was everywhere which moved my focus anywhere at anytime.
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Jim Flynt
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Posted: Nov 4th, 2006 10:28 pm |
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S. Smith wrote:
Regarding the sports teams, I don't know what the problem is. I do know that some teams do incredibly well year after year.
Here's a theory I heard recently. Someone told me they thought teams like football and boys basketball don't do that well at NWHS because the number of participants is diluted. In other words, in areas where there's not much else to do but play football or basketball, maybe they're more likely to excel. But at NW, there are so many sports teams to choose from. A kid who might be the best football player the school has ever seen might be playing soccer instead. This person also said because NW is such an affluent area, the "country club" sports are the ones that really excel, like golf and tennis, or the more "upscale" team sports like lacrosse.
What do you guys think about that?
Like so many of you here, I also attended and graduated from NWHS a long long time ago (Class of '68) and well remember all those years way back there where Northwest Guilford had a well regarded and winning basketball team year after year under Coach Roger Nelson (who would later become principal). For those who may not remember, Northwest Guilford won the State Boy's Basketball Championship in 1967 and in the immediately preceding years came in 2nd at least once (and maybe more) and in the top 4 several times.
I actually find your comments about 'affluent area' 'country club' and 'upscale' interesting as I still think there are many many families still living in the NW area in homes that were built 30, 40, 50 or more years ago and not in the 'McMansions' which are a more recent addition to our NW landscape only in the last 10 to 20 years. I think a more careful examination of the facts would probably reveal that there is a very real economic and social divide amongst the NWHS student population, which while not rising to the level of haves versus have nots, would more likely rise to a level of wants versus wants nots. From simply riding around and still seeing school children living in mobile homes in some of our communities, it would be all but certain that some students are still being left behind socially and economically. Sorry to shatter any myths here but let's at least have honest dialogue.
We were all mostly middle class (and mostly 'farm kids') back in those days, and perhaps that is why NW won so many basketball games. Kids back in those days didn't have Mommies and Daddies who gave them Mercedes Benz, Land Rovers and other expensive cars to drive to school, and most of us rode the bus to school (or drove the bus). If we had cars, we generally had worked after schools in jobs to pay or help pay for them.
Many NW students during that early time came from farm families and knew what farm work was, having to do it before and after school. We, none of us, even knew anyone who was a member of any country club way back then. And 'Day Schools' in this area had not even been 'invented' and did not exist.
I suppose in so many ways, in our own social ignorance and cultural naivety and with more modest agrarian roots, we were still so much more luckier and perhaps happier than kids and students today.
Many of those NW basketball players back in those days, went on to continue making a name for themselves on several college basketball courts under scholarships as well as becoming outstanding citizens. Perhaps if the NWO Observer tracked down Roger Nelson, he could share some insight into the reasons for success and failures of high school sports teams. Roger was the very best of the best in high school sports and will forever remain a wonderful reminder to so many of us of a great period in the history of Northwest High School. I also well remember that Coach Sandy Gann had some pretty darn good baseball teams way back then too.
I'll share some other comments about the NW Band program in a later post.
Last edited on Nov 4th, 2006 10:54 pm by Jim Flynt
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FatPappy
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Posted: Nov 5th, 2006 11:45 am |
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Jim Flynt wrote:
I suppose in so many ways, in our own social ignorance and cultural naivety and with more modest agrarian roots, we were still so much more luckier and perhaps happier than kids and students today.
I enjoyed that post, Mr Jim. Kris makes a lot o' sense up yonder too. I've said before I think young'uns are bein' pulled in too many directions these days. It waters down their focus an' gives the illusion of grand accomplishment but without any substantive achievement, except on paper. So many of the goals they're given seem like made up goals to me that sound good, but don't really advance the development of the young'un. I'm amazed at the load they've been given to carry, academically an' emotionally, an' amazed at how well they cope an' even excel. But it just seems like too much fer 'em to me an' I hafta wonder how long it can go on like that. Quantity ain't no substitute fer quality.
Makes me think of a beautiful green lawn that looks purty on top, but underneath the roots don't go very deep.
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Steve Adkins
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Posted: Nov 5th, 2006 12:18 pm |
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Agreed Pappy & Jim
I mentioned in a prior posting somewhere in here I was reading a book "Riddles of the Amish". Obviously I'm not Amish, nor do I plan to adopt their lifestyle, but there is some method to their uniqueness. Kind of ties into the above discussion.
To sum up a 300+ page book, their focus is on a simplistic life style, achievement equates to personal pride (which is a no no) therefore they avoid publicity, tremendous focus on family & community in a face to face manner, not with all the technology, competition against each other is avoided for exactly the reasons listed above.
Interestingly, 90% of Amish youth choose to stay in the Amish lifestyle when given the choice.
Jim Flynt wrote:
I suppose in so many ways, in our own social ignorance and cultural naivety and with more modest agrarian roots, we were still so much more luckier and perhaps happier than kids and students today.
Yep !!
Last edited on Nov 5th, 2006 12:19 pm by Steve Adkins
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